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Coming to terms with Christmas.

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#1
The White Coyote

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It is always a dilema for many of us at Christmas. We, as non-believers must make choices that sometimes feel hypocritical or just plain wrong. We as a common denominator do not believe in the birth of Jesus as anything more than a myth. Yet every year we are bludgeoned by Christmas carols, holy stories and nativity scenes around every corner. It can be very tiring and even depressing.
  A few years ago I wiped my holiday slate clean of my preconceived ideas about Christmas. I put aside all the bible stories I had heard as a child and began to look at Christmas from the eyes of someone who has always enjoyed a good fantasy story or historical mythology. I began to look upon the nativity and the birth of a savior as just another great mythology such as the Phoenix or perhaps the southwestern Kokopeli. As I looked at Christmas through these new glasses it was as if a great burden was lifted from my shoulders. No longer did I feel the hypocrisy of singing Silent Night or Away in a Manger. These beautiful little tunes that at one time were meaningless, suddenly became as fitting as Here comes Santa Claus or Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer. I realized that I could enjoy all the celebration of Christmas, even the nativity, as mythology and folklore.
  What is the difference between Angels and Fairies and wise men and wizards? If you look upon the story of the virgin birth and miraculous conception, doesn't that compare very closely to many greek mythologys?
  A few days ago I attended my grandsons first Christmas program. He's only three years old and goes to a christian pre school so the little program was about 75% about baby Jesus with just enough Santa thrown in for the kids. As I sat and listened to them singing (more or less) it came to me that to them, the story of Jesus being born was as real as Santa Claus and Frosty the Snowman. It was great! They look upon Christmas as magic and mythology, and that's the way we should see it also.
  You know it's a myth. I know it's a myth. So why let the idea of a myth, mythological songs and fantastic stories from long ago get us upset? The Easter Bunny, Santa Claus, The Great Pumpkin all have songs and celebrations. Why shouldn't we enjoy singing great old Christmas carols just because a lot of people believe them to be true?
  It would be great if a man was born of a God and was sent to save all the world from it self but that's just a bullshit story and we all know it. But I also think it would be great if little green men would land on earth from planet zebula and give us a cure for cancer too. Ones as likely as the other though so I will be damned if I will get upset and all militant over a nice little fantasy story. 
  Everyone here knows I am most likely the most realistic person on the boards. I even hate idealism and prefer to see things through clear colored glasses. I don't like the words shoulda, coulda or will be. I say things as they are. Christmas is a Christian holiday that celebrates the birth of a prophet, supposedly the son of God that was sent to earth to save us all from our own stupid decisions like eating shellfish and equally as destructive behavior. If we ignore the Christian portion of Christmas, the songs, stories and mythology, we are doing ourselves a great injustice. Look upon it as what it is and it will become an even more magical time and you will enjoy yourselves so much more.
  As children we all enjoyed stories of Paul Bunyan, Johnny Appleseed and Casey Jones. We grew up to Mother Goose and later the Muppets. How many of you still believe they are real? There was a time you believed, but as you grew older and wiser you began to realize they were just stories for entertainment and pleasure. Now we are supposedly wise enough to know the difference but I bet any of you still enjoy a good story of dragons and fairies. How many of us watched Lord of The Rings?
  The Nativity story is no different and as soon as you are able to put it in that perspective Christmas becomes a brand new holiday. Try it, You'll like it! :snork_lach:

#2
The Force

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I agree wholeheartedly, White Coyote. I loves Xmas, and for all reasons except the religious one. I don't recognize the birth of jeebus, but I have no problem listening to xmas tunes (my favs: O Holy Night, Carol of the Bells, Sleigh Ride), singing them, eating lots of xmas goodies, watching the Nutcracker ballet, and getting caught up in the whole spirit of the holidays, because that's all it is. It's a traditional holiday that can be mostly seperated from the religiosity but still be a fun time. Plus, it gives me something to look forward to during the hellish oppression of finals week. :santa:

#3
Unbeliever

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Yet every year we are bludgeoned by Christmas carols, holy stories and nativity scenes around every corner.


Yeah, I call 'em "jingle hells"!

#4
Unbeliever

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Kokopeli


I cant' help it - to me the word "Kokopeli" just shrieks with humor. Does anyone remember the episode of Star Trek Next Generation wherein Data was trying to learn human humor? He had a hohographic comedian (don't recall which one) who told him that any word with a K was automatically funny. I took that to heart, and now any word with a k really busts me up!

#5
Unbeliever

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What is the difference between Angels and Fairies and wise men and wizards?


Well, fairies are queer, but I'm unsure about the wise men and angels, I bet they're queer too. But maybe they're still in the closet. If the fundies knew they were queer, I bet they'd quit putting so much emphasis on 'em.

#6
Unbeliever

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If you look upon the story of the virgin birth and miraculous conception, doesn't that compare very closely to many greek mythologys?


Uh, duh?

#7
Unbeliever

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You might want to check out this post I made at EA:

http://www.ethicalat...587cb3477e45f87

Instead of reposting it every year, I think I'll just link to it, saves a lot of time.

#8
Unbeliever

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You know it's a myth. I know it's a myth. So why let the idea of a myth, mythological songs and fantastic stories from long ago get us upset?


Aw, I don't get upset anymore, I just try to ignore it as much as I can manage.

#9
Unbeliever

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Hey, I think that if the fundies want a war on Christmas, we should give 'em one. Fuck Jesus, fuck Santa, and fuck consuming. It's all bullshit, but hey, if it keeps the economy going, I've really got no fundamental problem with it.

#10
Unbeliever

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But I also think it would be great if little green men would land on earth from planet zebula and give us a cure for cancer too. Ones as likely as the other though so I will be damned if I will get upset and all militant over a nice little fantasy story. 


I beg to differ, but one's not as likely as the other. Little green men are at least physically possible, whereas a supernatural deity isn't. You could search the entire universe and you might find "little green men", but you will never find a supernatural diety. Oh, and "zebula" should be capitalized! 
:Wink:

#11
Frozenwolf150

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Everyone should be able to celebrate Christmas, because everyone does anyway.  Look around, and you'll see that nearly every culture and civilization has had some form of winter solstice festival.  It was Christians who swiped all their symbology and tried to monopolize their festivals, but obviously this is seriously disingenuous.  So Christmas isn't just for Christians, it's for everyone, regardless of your faith or lack thereof.

Winter Solstice Festivals from around the world

And just because I can't resist posting this:
The Spirit of Christmas

#12
Lisa Simpson

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My youngest son wants to put a sign in the front yard that says "Polar tilt, combined with the Earth's elliptical orbit around the sun is the reason for the season."  :snork_lach:

I don't think that would go over well in my neck of the woods, though.

#13
Unbeliever

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My youngest son wants to put a sign in the front yard that says "Polar tilt, combined with the Earth's elliptical orbit around the sun is the reason for the season."  :snork_lach:

I don't think that would go over well in my neck of the woods, though.


Hey, more power to the little tyke! Just how old is he, anyway? I wish I'd've been able to even contemplate such a thing when I was a wee sprite!

#14
Lisa Simpson

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He's 11 now, but he has always had an ability to think critically, even from the time he was a small child.  Now he struggles to deal with fundy classmates who think cave men didn't exist.

#15
Ungodly

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He's a sensible young man and very pleasant too. You have every reason to be proud of him, as I know you are of all of your fine children.

#16
The White Coyote

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Now he struggles to deal with fundy classmates who think cave men didn't exist.


Tell him not to struggle to hard. Arguing with a fundy is like arguing with an oyster. I have always found a great deal of satisfaction in knowing things others don't. It's a kind of proud humility to be able to have the truth in the palm of your hand while others about you wallow in stupidity. I just smile. :snork_lach:

#17
TopHat

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The irony for me in all of this about cavemen. My parents are the ones who taught me about dinosaurs, and that is where my love of archeology comes from yet they deny their existence.

Do I celebrate Christmas? No. Do I celebrate Corporate Christmas? No. I do not celebrate Christmas, because it is all about Jesus, and I don't believe in a myth. I don't celebrate Corporate Christmas, because I feel that my parents supply enough for me during the year, and I find it weird that my parents have this odd feeling to get me presents. I even denied new underwear.  It is as they feel that if I don't get something for Christmas they have failed as Christmas due to the Corporate pressure to buy, but I said I rather donate it, and it shall all be donated this year.

#18
Frozenwolf150

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^Well that's what we get for letting Christians define what Christmas is all about.

If you ask me, it's Christians that have ruined Christmas for everyone.

#19
Unbeliever

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I've recently come to the conclusion (just this morning) that Christmas is a feminist conspiracy to get men to go shopping. The rest of the year, men hate shopping, and can't easily be talked into doing it, but at Christmas they can't get away with not doing it. So they get dragged to the local temple of Mammon by their wives or girlfriends or mothers or daughters for a shop-fest which they just can't avoid because they'd seem like bad fathers/husbands/boyfriends/sons otherwise. Well, there's still a few of us men who are free of such considerations, and we have to not shop, just to keep the tradition alive for the rest of maledom.

#20
FlatEarth1024

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I've recently come to the conclusion (just this morning) that Christmas is a feminist conspiracy to get men to go shopping. The rest of the year, men hate shopping, and can't easily be talked into doing it, but at Christmas they can't get away with not doing it. So they get dragged to the local temple of Mammon by their wives or girlfriends or mothers or daughters for a shop-fest which they just can't avoid because they'd seem like bad fathers/husbands/boyfriends/sons otherwise. Well, there's still a few of us men who are free of such considerations, and we have to not shop, just to keep the tradition alive for the rest of maledom.


I went into Walmart Sunday to buy a few gift cards.  I paid for them at Electronics so I was basically in and out.  But from my parking spot to the Electronics department and then back again...no more than 15 minutes, I was pushed, shoved, bumped, kneed, tripped...and I may or may not have had sex with one or more persons.  By the time I reached the car I felt victimized - "The dirt won't come offfffffffffff........"


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